**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Tue Nov 11 10:52:18 2003 MST Nov 11 10:52:18 --> You are now talking on #C130Q Nov 11 11:01:56 <-- anstett has quit (CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)) Nov 11 11:02:06 Lost WSI GPSL again. Just going to fly without it for now. Nov 11 11:33:22 --> blanc-c130 (~ads@ras79.ucar.edu) has joined #C130Q Nov 11 11:33:27 --> blanc-c130 (~ads@ras79.ucar.edu) has joined #C130Q Nov 11 11:34:45 enroute moderate turbulence Nov 11 11:35:22 <-- blanc-c130 has quit (Client Exiting) Nov 11 11:36:19 --> campos (~c0375a14@linus.atd.ucar.edu) has joined #C130Q Nov 11 11:36:56 HI ron Nov 11 11:39:13 Hi. Can't stay long, since I have two meetings at ML soon. I'll be back around 6:00 EST Nov 11 11:44:29 --> anstett (~c0375a14@linus.atd.ucar.edu) has joined #C130Q Nov 11 11:48:03 Janet, Did you pass to jorgen about the nev probe working? Nov 11 11:51:01 ok I told him. Nov 11 11:51:40 --> jbj (~c0375a14@linus.atd.ucar.edu) has joined #C130Q Nov 11 11:52:08 Thanks Janet. Nov 11 12:02:56 We are about 20 min from starting our first research leg. Nov 11 12:09:56 --> brumbies (~d172ea7b@linus.atd.ucar.edu) has joined #C130Q Nov 11 12:10:17 Hi C-130, The Twin Otter is still on the ground at Durval, and there are some aiport problems due to strong gustiness, I understand. Given that we are somewhat early, and that they are possibly late, we should make sure the communication with the Twin Otter is good before the C-130 starts descending into the air that the Twin Otter was planning to fly in before our scheduled arrival. Ben bernstein asked me that we do not contact the Twin Otter right now, as they app Nov 11 12:12:03 JBJ missed last paer of your message after do not contact the otter. Nov 11 12:14:17 The Twin Otter is busy, and we should not contact them right now. Nov 11 12:14:42 Jorgen, I passed that information on to the pilots. Nov 11 12:15:11 We should be starting out first run soon. Nov 11 12:19:48 NASA is airborne now. Nov 11 12:21:17 --> sabl-c130 (~sabl@ras79.ucar.edu) has joined #C130Q Nov 11 12:22:45 Starting spiral sounding down to 3200 feet over miirabell. Nov 11 12:28:05 John, Did Hallett and Stith get the message about the Twin Otter. We have to coordinate with NASA, and we are still flying in their allocated time slot. My concern is that with their limited endurance, we should not push them aside without discussing it with the Twin Otter first. Nov 11 12:28:57 John, Nov 11 12:29:38 I will have to off-site and will be present at the hotel for the 3 PM briefing. Logging off shortly Nov 11 12:30:05 Jorgen, We are in radio contact with the otter now. They are going to do a sounding as soon as we finish ours. They are working out the details. Nov 11 12:30:18 OK Nov 11 12:30:50 <-- campos has quit (CGI:IRC (EOF)) Nov 11 12:31:12 Okay Jorgen. I will let you know how it is all working out when you login again. The pilots are reallyt busy right now. Nov 11 12:31:43 --> blanc-c130 (~ads@ras79.ucar.edu) has joined #C130Q Nov 11 12:32:37 hi jorgen, we are doing descent spiral in cloud Nov 11 12:33:01 any word on current wx from ground? Nov 11 12:33:14 What is the status of the convair? Jeff Nov 11 12:37:18 --> bernstein (~84f6c1f1@linus.atd.ucar.edu) has joined #C130Q Nov 11 12:39:21 Preparing for missed approach into Mirabell. Nov 11 12:41:06 BE CAREFUL! THERE HAVE BEEN STRONG GUSTS AT DORVAL AND STRONG DOWNDRAFTS ON THE MCGILL VERTICALLY POINTING RADAR! Nov 11 12:41:35 Downward velocities have been as high as 7 m/s and winds at Dorval gusted to 34kts. It looked very microburst like. Nov 11 12:42:02 Mirabel has only had winds to 12kts, but its something to watch out for. Missed approaches around these showers could be hazardous today. Nov 11 12:43:00 Thanks for the info. Relayed to pilots. Nov 11 12:47:09 Good. Thanks. Nov 11 12:47:22 ON that descent we had Slw between temperatures of about -12 and 0. Plenty of ice crystals around, so expect lw to be short lived. Nov 11 12:48:01 There were traces of slw at colder temperatures, but minor Jeff Nov 11 12:48:39 Estimate turbulence to be light to moderate Nov 11 12:48:44 OK. Conditions may actually improve with time.... more SLW as the seeding layer moves away. It may take a bit of tme, though. Nov 11 12:50:31 should be at about the outermarker inbound on approach Nov 11 12:52:41 Water dominated conditions should move into YMX at about 3:30pm (2030 UTC). Another shower, which will bring more significant ice cyrstals will have to move through first, though. Nov 11 12:53:13 Runway in sight. Nov 11 12:55:53 Completed missed approach. Nov 11 13:04:51 Now holding waiting for NASA to do missed approach then they are going to do a transsect at 6000. We are going to wait until they finish thier work then do ours. We are standing off for now. Nov 11 13:09:27 lots of slw at -2.8 (up to about 0.5 g m3) Nov 11 13:10:12 Very good! Nov 11 13:12:12 Having your data in real time is VERY, VERY valuable to us! Nov 11 13:14:51 Holding for about 10 more Min while NASA clears this altitude. Nov 11 13:16:03 significant lwc here at -2 to -3 (0.75), aggregates of columnar particles in spots, other spots have rimed particles Nov 11 13:17:53 <-- brumbies has quit (CGI:IRC) Nov 11 13:19:48 --> campos (~d172ea7b@linus.atd.ucar.edu) has joined #C130Q Nov 11 13:22:29 --> jensen (~d172ea7b@linus.atd.ucar.edu) has joined #C130Q Nov 11 13:23:25 We didn't have a formal forecast at the 3:00 timeslot due to so many being in the air. Nov 11 13:24:20 However, Wednesday sounds like Mirabel will be in the warm sector, with the freezing level being 5000 ft and cloud tops at about the same level. Not good for icing. Nov 11 13:24:55 Thursday will have a very strong cold front with strong gustiness. There will be snow showers and some low level moisture. Nov 11 13:25:38 Thursday AM is the next opportunity, but Wednesday can still be considered for an upstream flight. The forecasters will provide a trajectory shortly. Nov 11 13:33:13 --> brumbies (~d172ea7b@linus.atd.ucar.edu) has joined #C130Q Nov 11 13:33:55 Did FSSP freeze over - conc went to zero while PLWCC is still indicating cloud? Nov 11 13:37:59 We think that it iced up. We have a coating of ice over the whole plane at this point. Our next pass will be lower to clear the ice. We iced up DPT a while ago also. Nov 11 13:38:50 FSSP is working now. It must have iced up. Nov 11 13:39:06 Yep, we noticed it coming back to life Nov 11 13:40:49 I'm talking to the Convair. They would like to know what your plan is? Are you going to stay at your current altitude?... from Dave Marcotte. Nov 11 13:42:05 Convair will call you on the radio. Nov 11 13:43:19 Is Jeff or Hallett monitoring chat? Nov 11 13:44:34 --> mcfarq (~80ae503e@linus.atd.ucar.edu) has joined #C130Q Nov 11 13:45:38 Hi Greg, Nov 11 13:45:41 Things are fairly exciting for the C-130 right now. Nov 11 13:45:42 jeff has been looking at data and occasionally checking chat Nov 11 13:46:46 We have been in and out of freezing rain. Aircraft skin temperature near zero, so it has not been big problem, but we are watching it Nov 11 13:47:48 The current plan was to do a type 1 leg at this temp (-3 ambient) and then a missed approach (or lower leg) to get ice off instruments, etc. Nov 11 13:50:39 --> grendel-c130 (~ads@ras79.ucar.edu) has joined #C130Q Nov 11 13:51:45 planning on descent to 3200 for a low level leg Nov 11 13:52:19 That is non-classical freezing rain, if its not obvious. Nov 11 13:52:42 Jorgen, ooks like we may have lost PLWC1 during that last psss. It is reading about 1/3 what it usually does. Nov 11 13:53:13 OK, one thing I need to talk to the pilots about is the dropping ceilings and visibility in the area. It may not be of any concern to you, since you are returning to CLE. Does it matter to you? Nov 11 13:53:29 despite heaters), shilding the element, which then overheats in places. Nov 11 13:53:55 Is the CPI working oK? Nov 11 13:55:21 <-- blanc-c130 has quit (Ping timeout) Nov 11 13:55:24 <-- grendel-c130 has quit (Ping timeout) Nov 11 13:55:32 <-- sabl-c130 has quit (Ping timeout) Nov 11 13:55:43 <-- ADS-C130 has quit (Ping timeout) Nov 11 13:57:09 looks like we lost our satcom connection to the plane. Nov 11 13:57:21 --> ADS-C130 (~ads@ras79.ucar.edu) has joined #C130Q Nov 11 13:57:46 --> grendel-c130 (~ads@ras79.ucar.edu) has joined #C130Q Nov 11 13:58:23 --> blanc-c130 (~ads@ras79.ucar.edu) has joined #C130Q Nov 11 13:58:40 Yes, Janet - looks right! Nov 11 13:59:18 Missed some of the chat. Satcom phone shut down. Going lower to melt the ice from the plane. Nov 11 13:59:58 The CPI is working getting lots of data as are the all the probes. Nov 11 14:00:53 Pilots are aware of the dropping conditions. Nov 11 14:01:09 Convair is at 10,000, about to descend to 7,000. They have -5C there with large drops. Nov 11 14:01:21 Did I miss anything else? Nov 11 14:01:32 Dave Marcotte tells me that you plan to do a transect at 3000. After that, might you consider climbing to 12,000 or so? Nov 11 14:02:04 That is correct and the plan as I have heard it. Nov 11 14:03:34 <-- campos has quit (CGI:IRC (EOF)) Nov 11 14:03:45 OK, thanks. I hear that you are trying to melt off the ice by going down low... is that right? Nov 11 14:04:20 --> campos (~d172ea7b@linus.atd.ucar.edu) has joined #C130Q Nov 11 14:04:24 ben et al., there is an inversion starting at 4800 feet. Base of inversion is at a temp of about -4. Temperature increases to -1 or 1500 feet above, we were not able to get above it on last pass. Nov 11 14:04:45 That is correct. It sounds like most instruments are getting clear now. Nov 11 14:05:22 Jorgen, Definatly lost the PLWC1 Probe. Nov 11 14:05:38 <-- campos has quit (CGI:IRC (EOF)) Nov 11 14:05:41 OK - too bad. How are the DMT cloud probe doing? Nov 11 14:05:52 Ben, I'll try and get an update from Hallett on plans after this Nov 11 14:05:59 More good icing appears to be coming your way for a while yet. Cloud tops are warming to 10C. Nov 11 14:06:01 OK, thanks. Nov 11 14:06:29 --> campos (~d172ea7b@linus.atd.ucar.edu) has joined #C130Q Nov 11 14:07:14 Cleveland terminal forecast shows dropping ceilings, too. Nov 11 14:07:14 <-- campos has quit (CGI:IRC (EOF)) Nov 11 14:07:15 <-- brumbies has quit (CGI:IRC (EOF)) Nov 11 14:07:46 --> campos (~d172ea7b@linus.atd.ucar.edu) has joined #C130Q Nov 11 14:09:13 --> sabl-c130 (~sabl@ras79.ucar.edu) has joined #C130Q Nov 11 14:09:19 --> sabl-c130 (~sabl@ras79.ucar.edu) has joined #C130Q Nov 11 14:13:13 Our plan is to do some type 1 legs at 12,000 over the tops in clear air Nov 11 14:13:27 Broke out of clouds at 11K Nov 11 14:14:18 OK. Are there clouds above you? It looks like the upper cloud deck is moving out on satellite. Nov 11 14:15:46 looks like higher clouds off our left side, less cloud on right Nov 11 14:15:48 Frome the camera it looks somewhat broken above us. Nov 11 14:16:54 Thanks Nov 11 14:17:23 Convair is going to climb. Too warm down low. I tried to raise them on the phone to advise them of your cloud tops, but can't seem to do so. Nov 11 14:18:34 now have solid cloud above us Nov 11 14:20:39 How long will you plan to be around YMX? Will you descend back into the tops? Nov 11 14:21:47 We are planning to go down to just above cloud tops for about 15 to 20 mins maybe a bit less. Nov 11 14:22:21 --> beaton (~beaton@sbmac.atd.ucar.edu) has joined #C130Q Nov 11 14:22:23 Then will you descend into the tops? Do you have a long term plan? Nov 11 14:25:55 <-- anstett has quit (CGI:IRC (EOF)) Nov 11 14:26:02 C-130: Is there a plan to let the Convair descent in below you? Nov 11 14:26:22 Drop into the cloud, then look at higher layer sampleing above and below if we can get the clearances to do it. Nov 11 14:26:57 Convair is currently below us. Nov 11 14:27:30 Cleveland terminal forecast has a TEMPO 02-06Z with 800 ft ceilings and 2 miles vis with -DZ ... in case that matters to you guys. Nov 11 14:27:43 Prevailing ceiling/vis is better from 0Z to 6Z. Nov 11 14:29:37 Thanks for the update. Nov 11 14:30:05 Convair has 50 min left on station. Nov 11 14:34:02 tops of the clouds are at 10.5 kfeet Nov 11 14:34:13 Hope I haven't been bothering you guys too much... let me know if this level of talk is OK. Nov 11 14:35:29 It is good, Ben. Thanks. Nov 11 14:35:35 Well it is for me but other operators may not chat as much as I do. Nov 11 14:38:43 columnar crytals here at -5 Nov 11 14:40:28 Jeff, is that you on blanc-c130? Nov 11 14:41:20 yep Nov 11 14:41:37 We are climbing to try and get just below the upper cloud layer now Nov 11 14:42:00 Looks like a great case. Was there anything on the tail camera, and hod did the XICING begave? Nov 11 14:45:13 Well, xicing works OK, but not whole picture. We started sampling today with lots of ice in mixed phase cloud, including some heavy rimed particles and some aggregates. So the ice particles were giving us triggers on the xicing. We also found freezing rain and large drops that did not give a signature of Supercooled large drops on the blue pod region. Rather, they caused clear icing on the aircraft. However, we were warm enough that it did Nov 11 14:45:31 not accumulate enough to be a problem. Nov 11 14:45:44 blanc-Jeff Nov 11 14:45:45 OK Nov 11 14:46:59 doing our run below upper cloud and finding some fallstreaks of ice Nov 11 14:54:50 planning a run in the upper cloud about 1000 feet above base, followed by spiral down, and then perhaps following trajectory for return Nov 11 14:55:58 <-- campos has quit (CGI:IRC (EOF)) Nov 11 15:00:32 We are looking at radar images, and there appears to be plenty of more clouds upwind of your location. What is your fuel situation? Nov 11 15:00:42 Also going to do a missed approach. Nov 11 15:01:11 OK, thanks. Nov 11 15:04:50 Convair will head home for a 6pm landing. We will debrief and discuss the plan for tomorrow/Thursday. Nov 11 15:05:05 <-- sabl-c130 has quit (Ping timeout) Nov 11 15:05:15 <-- grendel-c130 has quit (Ping timeout) Nov 11 15:05:17 <-- blanc-c130 has quit (Ping timeout) Nov 11 15:05:23 <-- ADS-C130 has quit (Ping timeout) [NCAR power failure caused loss of chat from C-130Q at this time] **** BEGIN LOGGING AT Tue Nov 11 15:07:45 2003 MST Nov 11 15:07:45 --> You are now talking on #C130Q Nov 11 15:08:40 --> campos (~d172ea7b@linus.atd.ucar.edu) has joined #C130Q Nov 11 15:12:33 --> gzhang2 (~d172ea7b@linus.atd.ucar.edu) has joined #C130Q Nov 11 15:12:37 <-- campos has quit (CGI:IRC (EOF)) Nov 11 15:13:42 --> campos (~d172ea7b@linus.atd.ucar.edu) has joined #C130Q Nov 11 15:14:32 <-- beaton has quit (Client exiting) Nov 11 15:28:30 --> brumbies (~d172ea7b@linus.atd.ucar.edu) has joined #C130Q Nov 11 15:32:28 <-- campos has quit (CGI:IRC (EOF)) Nov 11 15:32:35 <-- brumbies has quit (CGI:IRC) Nov 11 15:34:11 --> brumbies (~d172ea7b@linus.atd.ucar.edu) has joined #C130Q Nov 11 15:39:48 <-- gzhang2 has quit (CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)) Nov 11 15:41:34 Waiting for C-130 to reconnect. They've been gone quite awhile now. Nov 11 15:42:01 <-- mcfarq has quit (CGI:IRC) Nov 11 15:45:02 <-- bernstein has quit (CGI:IRC (EOF)) Nov 11 15:47:36 <-- brumbies has quit (CGI:IRC) Nov 11 15:49:48 <-- jensen has quit (CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)) Nov 11 17:25:59 --> daniels (~daniels@atd-trout.atd.ucar.edu) has joined #C130Q Nov 11 17:26:32 <-- daniels (~daniels@atd-trout.atd.ucar.edu) has left #C130Q **** ENDING LOGGING AT Tue Nov 11 17:44:03 2003 MST